Creating the Sam & Julia brand: Karina and Manita Schaapman on The Mouse Mansion… And more!

Karina and Manita Schaapman, welcome! Thanks for joining me. We’re going to talk about your brand, Sam & Julia. Karina: for context, let’s start by talking about The Mouse Mansion. What is that?
Karina: The Mouse Mansion is a miniature world I created for my children’s book series. It’s entirely made out of cardboard boxes and scrap materials. It took me years to build and consists of hundreds of rooms… From apartments to shops, factories, and even a theatre, a harbour, museum and a circus. The Mouse Mansion is a safe world filled with a broad variety of unique inhabitants.

And I’ll put in a picture of this right at the top here because one has to see it to believe it! And who lives in The Mouse Mansion?
Karina: Two little mice, Sam & Julia. They couldn’t be more different, but they’re best friends. Julia is based on me; curious, outgoing and stubborn, living alone with her mother in a small one-room apartment… Sam is super shy and very well-behaved. He represents everything I didn’t have: a big family with lots of siblings and relatives, and a house with multiple rooms in a prominent location. Together, they go on adventures in The Mouse Mansion where they meet and discover everything about its varied inhabitants. I make stories and illustrate those stories with photographs from my Mouse Mansion.

What’s your background then, Karina? What inspired this?
Karina: My childhood! I was born in 1960 and raised by my single mother in a small house in the Netherlands. We were very poor, and my mother, who was originally from Indonesia, faced significant discrimination due to her foreign background, appearance, and status as a single parent. The neighbours often hurled racist insults at us, calling us derogatory names like “peanuts,” a slur for Indonesians. They criticised her for her looks and the smell of our Indonesian food. So it was a very hostile environment.

And it was just you and your mother, was it?
Karina: Yes… And while it was challenging, my mother was a proud woman who advised me to ignore the ignorance around us. We shared a close bond, sleeping in the same bed and without the distraction of TV or radio. She would tell me stories of her homeland, filled with exotic animals and foods, creating a warm and loving atmosphere amidst the challenges we faced. In any case, our life took a turn when the circus came to town. My mother met and fell in love with the circus director, and for a few years, I experienced a sense of belonging and acceptance in the circus community, where differences were embraced…

Unfortunately, this period of happiness ended when the circus went bankrupt, and my mother fell seriously ill. I was left alone at home for six months while she was hospitalised, facing isolation and neglect from our neighbours and the authorities. My mother passed away in early 1973. This period of my life deeply influenced me and became the foundation for creating The Mouse Mansion – a children’s book series. I wanted to create a caring, inclusive world that contrasted with the neglect and discrimination I experienced.

Well, I had no idea this would be quite such remarkable story, Karina, so I do want to thank you for sharing it. And you’ve answered one of my questions which was if you had any formal education as an artist – but the answered to that is – clearly – no…
Karina: No, that’s right… People often told me I should attend art school, but life didn’t take me there. Despite that, I’ve always been very creative. In fact, I used to make large sculptures until a neck injury forced me to make smaller works in 2008. That’s when I finally had time to work on that long-cherished dream: to make my own children’s books and – around that time – I started thinking about The Mouse Mansion.

As a book?
Karina: As book yes, but I also considered realising it as a drawing. When I opted for a three-dimensional approach, the project evolved organically. I began by using a blanket, a bed… A room made of fruit boxes for the structure. Eventually, I added the characters who became mice.

So the materials you use are things such as imaginary mice would use?
Karina: Yes, the materials are often scrap… Bottle caps are used to fabricate lamps, for example, bicycle lights become bottles, enamel jugs and buckets are made of paper, and popsicle sticks change into wooden floors. My goal is to inspire children to recognise and use the simple resources around them to create their own imaginative worlds. Anyway, two years after I started building the first Mouse Mansion, the first book was published. That was in 2011.

Amazing. And at some point, Manita, there must have been a decision to turn The Mouse Mansion books and building into a brand. How and when did that happen?
Manita: In the first years after Karina started creating stories, it was just her and the publishing house. After the books sold out, they got picked up internationally very quickly. It then became clear that mother could use some support. I’d just finished university and decided – together with one of my brothers, Ian – to help with the business so mother could focus entirely on the creative. Soon after that, my brother Tom and sister Lili also joined the team to work the creative and back office respectively. We slowly built the basis of what is now The Mouse Mansion Company. Ian focuses primarily on the commercial side and business development; I focus on e-commerce, product development and everything creative.

And to what degree were you aware that there was an audience for Sam & Julia beyond the books?
Manita: Well, from the very beginning, Karina received photos of fans who were building their own rooms and mansions inspired by the books. They often asked the same questions, like “What size box should I use?” and “How do I make furniture?” That’s how the arts and crafts product range started… We developed these crafts products and opened a little shop in Amsterdam where we showed kids the original Mouse Mansion. We now sell these products via our webshop and distributors worldwide!

Well, let’s talk about that… What do your products include?
Manita: The line consists of a Cardboard Room – an easy-to-build box that’s printed with wallpaper on all sides… With the corresponding furniture kits, you can furnish these rooms. With the die cuts, you can craft all kinds of paper accessories for your rooms, like little food boxes for the kitchen or tiny books for the living room. And when you finish crafting, you can take one of the plush characters to replay the stories from the books.

And there’s more than one room?
Manita: Yes, now have eight complete rooms and we plan to launch many more. But we also have some products outside of this core line. One of our most popular products is the Little Mouse Door. It’s a little door that you can place on a plinth in your room… It has a little picture of the Mouse Mansion when you open the door. And it comes with a tiny mailbox and little letters! It’s like there is a little entry to the Mouse Mansion in your room, and this lets you dream about the world behind your wall. This spring, we launched a new product we’re very excited about: The Mouse Mansion to Go…

Oh, that looks terrific!
Manita: So as you can see, the outside looks like a kid’s vintage suitcase – but it transforms into a little mouse room. The inside is printed with wallpaper and a floor. Karina always makes the designs for these products, so it really has the charm of her original Mouse Mansion. The suitcase contains everything you need to furnish and decorate the bedroom.

And this is new, you say? But it’s out now?
Manita: Yes. These products are sold via our web shops, our museum and brand store in Amsterdam and in selected retail points… Book stores, independent toy stores, gift and concept stores and so on. We have dedicated distribution partners in Spain, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, France, US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and Costa Rica – and more to follow! Because last year, we also worked on a robust licensing strategy and structure, including signing agents that are now up and running across Europe, Australia and New Zealand.

And what kind other kinds of product would you like to see on the market through licensing?
Manita: I think the possibilities with this brand are unlimited. We’ve had so many products ideas through the years but decided to focus on the crafts first… Simply because that’s something we, as a creative company, are good at. From our experience in manufacturing our own products, we believe it’s invaluable to have strong partners that are really good at the product categories they manufacture.

In terms of products that fit the brand well and that I’d personally get excited about would be timeless toys like a tea-set. Something else I’m excited about is a line of vehicles, based on the ‘craftsy’ vehicles you can spot in the Mouse Mansion. From hot air balloons to soap box cars, the Mouse mansion has it all! Our artwork has that vintage charm but is still very much a modern and recognisable brand for children. We have much more to offer than some pictures and a logo and can’t wait to see how children will enjoy all the lovely, licensed products that are to come.

We just briefly touched on this, but what else do you look for in a licensing partner?
Manita: Everybody remembers that one special toy from their childhood, or that one cool lunchbox that’s now a collectible. That’s what we want to create: a core childhood memory around our brand. Of course, that starts way before the licensed product; it starts with the stories. We’re proud that our stories resonate so well with young readers – and now with young viewers around the world. Had that not been the case, we’d never have been able to be successful in the products we’ve developed so far. We’re looking for licensing partners that recognise and get excited about joining forces to bring those special products to the market.

You briefly mentioned viewers there – I want to come back to that in a moment but – Karina… Anything to add?
Karina: Yes, I’d add that our partners need to catch the spark and get excited about the brand with passion – just like us. We’re in this for the long run, so we don’t look for quick hit and run deals. We hope to ignite the love for the brand in each of our licensing partners and make our collaborations with them long-lasting. That should result in products that have been developed with love and care and that will help turn Sam & Julia into a much cherished and evergreen brand.

Manita: We also value teamwork, and encourage all our partners – licensing agents, publishers, distributors and licensees – to work in synergy and collaborate where possible. For example, when we’re working on a new product, we’re often able to place an order out front that covers the Minimum Order Quantity. That makes it much easier for licensing partners to move ahead.

And in regard to values, is there anything specific you’re looking to promote with this brand?
Manita: Our mission is to inspire families around the world to be creative, welcoming and kind. We would like to see that mission as part of the product development as much as possible. A gender neutral and multicultural approach matches the brand well. Also, we always love to think of ways to make products more creative. In terms of stuff we won’t do, one red line would be violence… I can’t imagine that there would ever be, for example, any war-related or violent toys.

Brilliant. Thank you, Manita. You mentioned viewers; I said I’ll come back to it… and so I have! Tell me about the TV series!
Manita: It follows the adventures of Sam & Julia in wonderful animation! There are 78 episodes in the first season – each one seven minutes long. The show premiered last Christmas on France TV and Okoo. It also launched in The Netherlands in March and Germany will follow later this year. Also, Sweden and Slovenia have been confirmed. More countries will follow, to be announced in the next months. All 78 episodes are now finished.

Amazing! Karina, you must be thrilled to pieces…
Karina: Oh, it’s a dream come true to see Sam, Julia and the other characters come to life. When you allow a studio to make a TV series based on your books, you take a real leap of faith. But they really delivered! When I first watched the episodes, I was moved to tears… They recreated so many things that have a deep meaning to me. For example, a painter in the show paints the little paintings that my husband made in real life – he passed away two years ago…

Also, they kept Julia’s apartment in the TV series as humble as I made it in the books. In fact, there’s a scene in one episode in which Julia and her mum share a single bed – just like I did with my mum. I think that’s important because many TV series these days show kids in perfect households living perfect lives. In real life, though, many kids have to deal with broken families or poverty… So the fact that our TV series shows my history makes me very hopeful that kids will be able to relate to Julia.

Great answer, Karina; thank you. And what’s next for the brand, Manita?
Manita: We’re looking forward to building the brand further… Where we don’t have the classic books in the market, we’re actively look for new publishing partners. We’ll further expand our distribution network for our own product range. We’ll build our licensing programme together with our agents… And last but not least, we’ll explore Location Based Entertainment opportunities.

We do need to start wrapping this up, but I’m curious: how do you stay creative, Karina?
Karina: Feedback from the readers is, for me, very inspiring. It’s not only children who create a Mouse Mansion on their own but also with whole families or neighbourhoods. The fact that my stories touch so many people around the world makes me believe that we’re all a part of a community; that we want to take care of each other… So that inspires me to keep spreading the message of love and acceptance through my creations.

Brilliant. Final question, then. What’s the one thing I could’ve asked you about today but didn’t? And what’s the answer?
Manita: Hmmmmm. You could’ve asked us: How does someone get in touch for licensing opportunities? That would be via Jeannine Lafèbre, who manages our global licensing programme and foreign publishing. Or, of course, one of the local licensing agents we’ve already signed up: Licensing Link in the UK, France TV Distribution in France, Active Merchandising – GSA, Edebé Licensing – Iberia, Bic in Italy, Lit Licens in the Nordics and Centa IP for Australia and New Zealand.

Terrific! Well, it sounds like you’ve built a wonderful team, a wonderful world and a wonderful brand. Thank you so much for making time to tell us about them.